Here is the basic deal.
There are two "possible shutdowns: occurring. One on the US side, one on the Guat side. They are independent of one another:
1.) The US side: The US will ratify/implement the Hague sometime later this year or early next year. The DOS, as the Central Authority, has said that if Guatemala has not passed and implemented what the US deems Hague compliant legislation by the time we implement the Hague, then they will stop issuing Visas. They have said that as long as you have an I600A filed before we implement the Hague, that they will grandfather you in and allow you to complete an adoption.
2.) The Guat side: There is this protocolo looming and no one knows exactly when it will be implemented or exactly what it will mean. Though the ADA has clearly offered their take on it. There is a RUMOR that it will be implemented April 1 and that if you do not have a POA registered in Guatemala (which takes about a week after they receive your authenticated POA) that you will not be able to complete the adoption. Or rather that the new protocol will apply to it which may very well mean you will never get that child home. But that is a rumor that we have not been able to verify. The protocolo, if instituted, will be challenged in the courts and the ADA seems confident they can beat it as they did with the Hague in 2003. But the political landscape is quite different now compared to 2003. Not being a Guatemalan legal scholar or political expert, I cannot offer up any opinion on whether the ADA is being overly optimistic. I do have no reason not to trust their knowledge of the Guatemalan constitution.
In addition, as we have posted on Guatadopt, new legislation is slated to be introduced to the Guatemalan congress this week. Some changes were made to its original form to satisfy the folks at the Hague. It has received tacit approval from the DOS months ago. This legislation, though I do not have the specifics of it, SHOULD keep adoptions open as a viable option and introduce some improvements or safety mechanisms. BUT, the DOS has been less than transparent and their recent FAQ (also posted on Guatadopt) was a huge surprise to everyone "in the know" and there is some concern that even if Guatemala passes this legislation, there is no guarantee that the US will accept it as being Hague compliant. Ultimately, what the folks at the actual Hague think is irrelevant. The way the convention works, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. And by that I mean that each country decides for itself whether to accept the system of another country. I hope that makes sense.
3.) Agencies: Many good agencies have formal contractual policies about what happens financially in the event of a shutdown. And by that I don't mean the "you are sh*t out of luck” clause, rather that you receive back some of what you have paid. These agencies have worked these out with their attorneys. Some times these are agencies where you do not directly pay the attorney, rather all the foreign fees are paid directly to the agency, making them contractually obliged to live up to it. If it were me considering starting an adoption right now, I would only use an agency like this. It does not mean others are bad or crooked, but it is an insurance policy in the event that the worst comes to fruition.
Guatadopt will be updating the site as we get new info. The hard part for us right now is that we do not like to offer up our opinions too much because we are not psychic and even though we will write things like "MY OPINION", people often times take it as the gospel and that is too much responsibility for us.
With that said, here is MY OPINION: The DOS FAQ is scary. They seem to be trying to strongly dissuade people from taking referrals at this time. The timing of it is interesting as well because they issued it right after Bush and Berger met. My OPINION is that the two presidents reached some deal that did this POA registered cutoff thing and agreed on when the protocolo would be instituted. The April 1 rumor (which I have had confirmed by some reliable sources and denied by others) also started right after they met. However, I don't know what impact the new legislation might have on whatever was agreed to. I don't know if the impending protocolo and Bush-Berger apparent agreement got the legislation put on the fast track. I would personally be very hesitant to start an adoption at this point. But I think we're all adults, know our personal and financial situations, and know how much risk we can accept. There are innocent children who deserve families and despite DOS's ominous statements that do raise valid issues and problems in the current situation, most adoptions are not full of problems. The bad stuff has gotten worse recently, I am seeing that personally. But the good agencies and attorneys have not recently sold their souls and they are still doing things the right way.
Thanks Kevin for the detailed update! I am hoping all this turns out to be for the good of the children and adoptions altogether! We are also hoping any change will be implemented slowly and in process adoptions are not affected? Wishful thinking I am sure, but you have to stay positive, or else you'd go crazy, right. CC
Posted by: CC at March 18, 2007 10:19 PMThank you for the update. It seems the situation is very fluid and we are hoping and praying that we all get to bring our children home.
Posted by: BD at March 18, 2007 11:45 PMKevin it's true we don't know what will happen in regards to adoption in Guatemala. But I have waited a very long time for a child and in my heart I know that child is somewhere in Guatemala. I will stay the course and keep the faith. I will tread lightly and make very sure of every decision. I do have my I600A filed but have not received a referral as of yet. My hope is that things will all be worked out in God's time not ours. I pray every day for a resolution to this and that the children of Guatemala will not be left behind. You have a great site here. Keep up the good work.
Nancy
very good overview -- we are moving forward with our adoption and lets the chips fall where they may.
Posted by: sam at March 19, 2007 12:18 AMKevin,
thanks for the clear update of the complexities of all sides around what is going on.
If the April 1st deadline is real, it might be worth for thise with referrals to fly down to sign POA with lawyer and translator to reduce the 1 week timeline you mention from when POA is flown to guatemala. While tiring, i recently did just that when rumor of protocolo reading cutoff of ~march 1st. Flight costs on the short notice were not any higher than for what i plan for 2 months from now for a visit trip.
good thoughts to all of us in this difficult time.
rgds
tk
Thank you so much for putting this all into perspective....it is nice to get the overview in a clear, concise statement!
Kevin,
Thanks for the clear explaination. It is so hard to really understand all of the complexities of the situation. I have decided to stay the course and hope for the best.
Posted by: Susan at March 19, 2007 06:48 PMKevin, can you give me an average length of time that cases are currently in family court and also in PGN? We are waiting on a (family)court date. Thank you. Also, thanks for the great update on the state of affairs. Being new to all of this, your details are very helpful.
Posted by: Lorri at March 19, 2007 10:00 PMhi good info wish i knew someof this 6years ago when i received my greatest gift my adopted son and I have been fortunate. God bless you for your insight.
Posted by: bj at March 20, 2007 12:08 AMWe have been working on our adoption for a long time, and are at last ready for a referral for a child. We do know if we can start again from scratch with another country. It may take as long as waiting out the current situation.
Loretta and Joe
My son and his wife returned from Guatemala two weeks ago after visiting and spending a week with their son who is in foster care. In your opinion, what lies ahead for them? Below is their current status.
We received notification that we have exited Family Court. That is good news and one more thing marked off our list.
We are in between the other two steps, our lawyer decided to submit us early to the final step without our US Embassy Pre-approval. This is common because the paperwork sits so long in the final step (known as PGN) before it gets reviewed. He is trying to get us in line early hoping we will get the Pre-approval before they get to our case. If the timing works out this is great news if it doesn't we aren't any worse off and we will just get denied and resubmitted when the Pre-approval arrives.
Posted by: LarryG at March 20, 2007 10:47 AMI have a question about my status related to the info above. My dossie was sent to Guatemala about 2 weeks ago. (I have a child placed w/ me.) My 1-600A was sent to Homeland Security in January, and I had my fingerprints in early February. My adoption agency just received their copy of my 171H today, and I am waiting for mine to fax to them as soon as I receive it.
So, Kevin, or others, based on my status, how do you think I sit? Also, what is the "POA" that has to be registered in Guatemala.
thanks for any info.
Posted by: mark Nissen at March 21, 2007 01:05 AM"POA" is power of attorney. You should sign this along with acceptance of responsibility for your child. Hope this helps. CC
Posted by: CC at March 21, 2007 10:29 PMThank you. I actually found the definition of the acronym shortly after I posted my question. I've completed by POA already. Just hope it has been filed in Guatemala.
I found this very helpful outline of the entire process at the URL below. Not sure if guatadopt has something similar, but it helps bring clarity to the sometimes confusing/complicated process.
Good wishes to everyone.
http://www.guatefam.org/process.htm
Posted by: mn at March 22, 2007 12:16 PMEnjoyed reading your opinion. My opinion is stay out of the negative chat rooms and follow your agencies advice. Be pro-active in all paperwork and ask the agency what the financial policy is at this time. Consider a back-up country if neccessary and no matter what....don't give up on your adoption, even if it leads you down another path. Stay strong!
Posted by: CO at March 22, 2007 03:43 PMKevin, kelly and others,
Thank you so much for guatadopt.com. It is a LABOR OF LOVE. The information provided has literally made the difference between going crazy and staying sane.
Best, Cheryl
Posted by: cheryl at March 22, 2007 06:58 PMKevin, what happens when the birth mother can't be found for DNA?
Posted by: Dee at March 24, 2007 01:56 AMDee,
If the birthmother has disappeared then she had abandoned the child. In order for the adoption to be completed, the child would have to first go through the abandonment process.
Kevin
Guatadopt.com
Kevin, under the current conditions, after DNA testing is completed, about how long is it taking to complete adoption? bkb
Posted by: bkb at March 25, 2007 08:45 AMbkb,
I would not venture to offer up an opinion. I don't think we know exactly what the future holds on timelines. We will all have to wait and see...
Preapprovals have been running about 6 weeks, but I think that is subject to change.
I have to wonder if the DOS doesn't issue statements to correspond with when a change in rigor will actually start. But that is pure speculation.
Kevin
Guatadopt.com
Kevin,
Thank you so very much for your insights and help!!!
Posted by: sandra at March 26, 2007 10:58 AMDear Kevin, This is a wonderful thing you are doing here. We are in to 17,000.00 and still no child. We get pics all the time, but they ask us for more money and the DNA isn't done yet, so we told the agency that no more money until the DNA is done. Every week its we can't find the mother then they found her but need four wheele drive to get to her. We don't know what to believe anymore and now this with the Hage stuff. We just want to bring our little boy home. This is nothing, i could tell you stories that would curl you hair! I want to keep the faith. Dee
Posted by: Dee at March 27, 2007 03:38 AMMy husband and I were just waiting for our pink slip to be issued...any chance you've heard anything about people who just completed PGN and how all of this if effecting their adoptions?
Posted by: nicki at March 27, 2007 04:43 PMKevin,
Do you know anything about the April 1 rumors about shutting down adoptions in Guatemala. Some flew there to get POA in place before this date...so now we are wondering what is actually taking place.
Kevin,
I have read your comments from time to time and all I can say is who do you think you are????? You are truly an ASSHOLE!!!! It's people like you that make this whole process seem negative. You need to get a LIFE!! I just couldn't hold that back anymore.
Posted by: at May 22, 2007 10:20 PMKevin,
I have read your comments from time to time and I just have to say who do you think you are???? You are truly a JERK!!!! It's people like you that give this whole process a bad name....you need to get a LIFE!!!
Posted by: Heather at May 22, 2007 10:28 PMno, Heather, it is most certainly not people like Kevin who "give this whole process a bad name" - it is the crooked and deceitful adoption service providers who do that. (note, I do not believe that all Guatemalan service providers are scoundrels, but I have been around long enough to know that there is a lot of shall we say 'unfortunate' activity in this industry.) When I read your comment, I think of people blaming "whistleblowers" for the bad acts they are bringing to light. There has been a lot of bad stuff going on in Guatemala for many years, and while I am sad that it has not been 'cleaned up' behind the scenes, I am very glad that the abuses are finally being exposed and *addressed*. I know it is both scary and painful for APs and PAPs to read some of the stuff that GuatAdopt prints, but Kelly & Kevin are truly *serving*, not hurting, the Guatemalan adoption community, including my family and perhaps yours as well?
Posted by: GuatAdopt fan at May 23, 2007 04:58 PMHeather, I suggest that if you dislike reading Kevin's comments, DON'T READ THEM. There are a million and one other things you can do with your time. I don't know what YOUR problem is, but suggest that you might want to consider seeking professional help to deal with your anger issue. By the way, I've met Kevin, his wife, and both of their children, and there's nothing negative about any of them. Perhaps it is you that should get a life. Koo koo kachoo.
Gregg
Posted by: Gregg at May 23, 2007 07:45 PMWhy did it take this person almost 2 months to put a comment on? This article is dated in March!!! If there is someone who needs a life, it is this person.
Keep up the good work guys/gals!
Posted by: Tim at May 24, 2007 02:54 PMDear Kevin and readers. My husband and I recently brought our 15 month old daughter home from Guatemala after numerous delays, miscommunications, and 4 visits to see her. We've learned some things along the way: There are well intentioned attorneys out there processing adoptions but it seems that they have taken on too many cases and are very slow to act on the adoptive parents behalf. The obvious other problem is getting tied up in the beauracracy in Guatemala. We were put into the investigation unit in PGN for 5 months because our daughters birthmom was a minor. They had all the papework they needed to show that the adoption was supported by the birth family yet there we sat. Maybe you have already covered this but there are adoption supervisors located in Guatemala that you can hire that will monitor your case and give you regular updates. I know 2 families that have hired them, the first got their child home immediately, the second has just hired them and said she gets regular updates and has found out her agency wasn't being truthful about where she was in the process. The man's name is Marco Tulio Merida and he is an attorney in Guatemala that supervises adoption cases. We talked to him towards the end of our process but he encouraged us to hang in there with our attorney because we were close to the end and he didn't think we needed his services, he was right. His email is mtm@desprosa.com. His phone number is (502)2369-5577 or (502) 2369-3920. Let me know if this is helpful. I also agree with you in that adoptive parents need to be proactive. I finally asked our attorney to schedule an appointment in PGN for he and I to talk to one of the supervisors in PGN. We went in and had PGN approval within a few days. It pays to be persistent!
Posted by: Rene at May 30, 2007 07:58 PM
Hi Everyone,
I need some advice. I received a referral of a 7-month-old boy nearly ten months ago. At that time, I was told by my agency that the adoption process was approximately 4-5 months. After that time period had expired, my agency began to expect regular foster care payments each month, which I have paid. I have committed about $20,000 so far to this adoption. My agency is unable (or unwilling?) to tell me when we might be able to bring him home. We have been in PGN for several months. In mid-August our case was thrown out of court, reportedly because they needed more pictures of our house (which I provided immediately). My family thinks I am nuts to keep sending money with no end in sight, and I'm beginning to agree. I don't think my agency is unethical or bad, but I do think they might be ineffective and incapable of dealing with the current situation. Any suggestions on how I should proceed?? I previously completed two international adoptions from Russia which went absolutely flawlessly and were completed in 7 months. This situation is so entirely different from anything I experienced previously - its kind of bewildering.
Thanks!
Posted by: Janet Welsh at September 18, 2007 09:36 PM