casa quivira has previously stated that no court orders were necessary and that a relinguishment notary was sufficient for custody as opposed to court ordered custody pending adoption. i am not sure if they are unaware of the PINA law referred to by the Embassy or if for some reason it does not aply to case Quivira. in any event, let us pray for the children and the waiting families as the court's sort through this situation.

I don't really have anything to say to this, except that I am thinking about every one for their children to be safe and come home.
Something just happened to me: I just arrived to GC this early afternoon (2nd visit trip). The foster family and facilitator were supposed to be here at 5 p.m. with my baby. I am not 100% sure,but I think our FF is a cab driver, so apparantly they drove in a taxi and I think it's theirs. It was already almost 30 minutes past 5 when the facilitator called me and said, that police stopped them and wanted to see the taxi and car papers and that they will be little late. Another 45 minutes and he calls again, saying, that now they want to see the adoption papers for the baby in the taxi (OUR baby!!!!!). So they were showed whatever papers the FF had on her and they wanted to see all the legal adoption papers. So they called the lawyer and he is getting that to them. I don't know if they are at the police station or on the street or where. Facilitator says not to worry, that if police sees a baby in a taxi, they always check the papers. In light of what happened with the papers police "wanted to see" - and then took away - at Casa Quivira. How much more of this I can take I don't know. I feel like I am being punished for something.
The update is that FM and our baby is at the police station right now and they are wanting more documents. I don't really know what will happen now.

Hi Kevin, the "PINA" reference is to the Guatemalan law Convention on the Rights of the Child (La Convención Sobre los Derechos del Niño).

http://www.law.yale.edu/rcw/rcw/jurisdictions/amc/guatermala/frontpage.htm

Way at the very bottom of this link is a link to a .pdf version of the law in Spanish. I think it is a mere 53 pages long. Between those two factors I have not been able to determine where exactly this issue is in this law.

Lisa

I have learned that this is an extreme legal stretch of the PINA law. It is actual a law to protect children whose rights have been violated by their family. It is not designed to apply to notarial adoptions according to the information I received. I'm sure someone will post more and I'm certainly no Guatemalan legal scholar, but this is what I have learned.

Kevin
Guatadopt

JHS...
I'm sorry you are going through this, but it is actually quite common. Our foster mother was detained outside of the Marriott back in February. Our local agency was down there for a visit. The police stopped her near the McDonalds. Our attorney had to come down and show papers (HA... little green papers with presidents faces on them!!) and they let her go. Hopefully by now your issue is resolved and your baby is safe in your arms. ~hugs~

I'm not a Guatemalan legal scholar either, Kevin, but the ones I've spoken to here in Guatemala assure me that the Law that Josefina Arellano and other government officials are using as a justification for raiding foster homes and hogars IS only for children whose rights have been violated by their families, through abuse or neglect. Those children cannot be taken into licensed children's homes (institutionalized) without a court order.

It makes no legal sense to think that children who are relinquished in the Notarial process, which is the constitutional right of the biological parent(s) would require a court order. The biological parent relinquishes before a notary, and then gives a power of attorney for custody to the foster family or Hogar. Essentially the government is saying that they can raid any hogar or any foster family who doesn't have a court order for custody of the child, while there is absolutely no law requiring them to have a court order and no procedures in place to get such court orders. Children can be removed from the security of their foster situation, their health and well being is being seriously compromised, for primarily political and propaganda reasons.

First the media reported that the children's home was illegal. Then one publication stated that the children were kidnapped for adoption. Today the papers stated that the children have been placed in other facilities while their status is being reviewed to assure that they have not been kidnapped. Now the Enbassy is being told that a hitherto unapplied law is being applied.

It is legitimate to investigate complaints re: specific children -- it is not legitimate to create a witch hunt atmosphere and then claim there are laws to justify this, putting children at risk for political and propaganda ends. I continue to see this as a shameful abuse of power which has nothing to do with what should be in the best interests of children.

Ironically, in the same Sunday edition that announced the raid on CQ, on page 20 of Siglo XXI was a long story about children who have been twice abused: first by their parents from whom they were removed and second by the State who provided no services for them. The Guatemalan government needs to be accountable to the children who are abused and abandoned, who are all being supported by private funding --- instead of being dedicated to disrupting the one current available solution (ICA) which provides thousands of children a year with permanent, loving families.

How this persecution of ICA can continue while over 30,000 children a year in Guatemala die from treatable illnesses, more than 50% are malnourished, and the State provides almost NO services to over 20,000 children who are court adjudicated into private children's homes and supported by humanitarian aid... is something that just doesn't compute.

Hannah Wallace, Adoptions International

Kevin, I have a question about this PINA law. Does every adoption have to have this court-determined custody order? I mean, not just children who are in hogars, but also who are in foster care? Is this something we should be finding out from our agencies, that this custody order has been obtained?

Thanks again for all you do!
Kris

Adoptive Parents waiting for their children to come home from CQ, you will be in my prayers along with the children. Our first adoption was with CQ and it went much smoother than our second one in process now in Guat. City where our daughter is already one. I do believe that the Guatemalan people have big hearts for their children and wherever these babies may be transfered they will receive good care. They are very protective of their children and love them as their own. I think we as Americans can take note of the value that they place on their children. Please take solice in that and truly my heart goes out to you. God bless you.

JHS,

I am so sorry for what you are going through; I hope by the time you read this email you will have had your baby already in your arms and enjoying your visit trip. We just received our DNA match and will visit next month. My heart goes out to all of us.

All the families from and children who are involved with CQ, you are also in our prayers!

I am so sad about all of the turmoil in Guatemala right now. We brought our son home in February and had an easy, wonderful experience. It is my hope and prayer that things will settle down and the waiting children and parents will also have an easy and wonderful experience. My heart breaks for the children in Guatemala and I pray daily for their health and safety.

So Steve, according to your philosophy, wouldn't it have been better for you to donate the $3000-$5000 you spent on eye surgery to help find a cure for blindness then to realize your dream of seeing clearer?

To JHS: Please update us when you can. I hope your baby is safe with you now.

To Barb: I agree that the Guatemalan people as a whole do love their children. But if there is no suitable place to take these children, no money to buy food, no medical care, not enough people to take proper care of them, how is the "love" they feel going to help? The Guatemalan government needs to figure out "how" to care for these children....before they remove them from hogars or foster homes that are taking good care of them.

Just my .02 cents.

An update on my baby and the police: after the attorney showed them the adoption papers and, Theresa, yes, the green papers too, they let them go and I held my baby finally at 10 p.m.

This was the most sickening thing.

JHS,

Thank goodness you must be very releived!!!

Lisa